That's because you weren't paying attention to what I said, and because we weren't talking about the core but rather a specific instantiation and how its was being messaged. I've always accepted that this is a core problem. Since, like, I first learned world history as a teenager.

The question is how we understand how and whether this core trait is being expressed in any particular situation, and you could see from the beginning that I was acknowledging a role of something like that here.

My very first reply mentioned "#notallmen", which is entirely consistent with this as a core issue...because my point was that people wanted a way to feel valued not to be stereotyped.

My second reply said "Distinctions provoke movement towards the good end of the range." Why is the good end of the range good? What is the problem with the bad end?

My third reply acknowledged, "The most boxed quintile seems trapped in a psychologically volatile and socially destructive pattern of behavior." Also consistent with aggressive dominance hierarchy as a core issue.

My fifth reply starts with, "I'm not defending the norms. I'm pointing out the boneheaded strategy that keeps being used while supposedly trying to change norms."

If you listen to what I say more closely, you won't spend so much time telling me things that I already know without actually addressing the issue I'm trying to discuss.

Anyway, hopefully your story on outreach for changing masculine norms will be useful to people. I certainly wasn't expecting it in your original here. I've already explained what I was trying to convey.